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witchdoctor wrote:GoatMan wrote:witchdoctor wrote:If that which lives is made of the same material as what does not live, what extra property not existing in that material must be added to it in order to make it live?
What we call elements are combinations of patterns.
Life is a combination of patterns.
Consciousness is an emergent property from specific combinations of patterns.
Metal does not pre-exist existence.....it is a combination of patterns, brought into balance under specific circumstances.
The unity can only be torn asunder by a force exceeding the attraction force within this unity.
All unities have both attraction/repulsion - tensions. They become balanced only when the attractive force, harmony, exceeds the repulsive force, disharmony.
The apparent is a combination of patterns.
We agree.
Life and consciousness both emanate from nature. The nature we understand as matter, because we are matter.
There is no essense outside from nature which creates life and consciousness.
There is agreement here. We are not saying different things.
witchdoctor wrote:Is there an unique and rare, magical essense of life which exists outside of matter, and is not an attribute of matter?
You describe life as a magical element...like matter/energy.
I don't think that I do. Are matter-energy magical?
Matter is not life.
Life emanates from matter.
Life is a particular and rare combination of matter, with a specific process of iteration and storage of memory that informs its iteration, and this may develop into an organism.
An organization we call life.
We agree. The only difference apparent to me is that you seem to hold the opinion that life, consciousness, and intelligence are attributes one can either have, or not have, like flipping a switch. One either has life, or does not have life. One either has consciousness, or does not have consciousness. One either has intelligence, or does not have intelligence.
I believe that these attributes exist in an infinitely gradual scale, in all shades of grey from near-white to near-black.
witchdoctor wrote:Implies by whom, to who?
Whoever implied that to you is not here, unless that is you. It was you after all who brought this word into conversation.
Once again, I do not posess greater knowledge than you.
the word occult implies it.
Like matter having a magical property which is life. You appear to have knowledge only a few posses....mystical knowledge.
Who said anything about occult to begin whith?
I deny having knowledge that only a few possess.
The things I say have been written about for millenia. They are available to all.
You cannot claim that you never received a package if you've only glanced at it, and then threw it away.
You know matter is living, so every rock is alive...or are you not saying this?
No. Not alive as you seem to conceive of it.
I say that rock has the potential to an ever increasing level of aliveness.
At which state of alivenes it might be, nobody can say. If you are looking for a certainty about how life emerges, you ought to look elsewhere... to paraphrase a friend.
witchdoctor wrote:No, we cannot change the nature of a rock by saying "this rock is alive" or by saying "this rock is not alive". We do not disagree about this.
But, for you, a rock has life, or the element of consciousness.
Consciousness is like a particle, an element.
No. Consciousness is an attribute of matter.
Regardless, what I think does not change the nature of a rock.
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Conversation on Monism
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
Join date : 2018-02-13
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
Join date : 2018-02-13
GoatMan wrote:I doubt it....we agree superficially.witchdoctor wrote:We agree.
Life and consciousness both emanate from nature. The nature we understand as matter, because we are matter.
There is no essense outside from nature which creates life and consciousness.
There is agreement here. We are not saying different things.
Matter = patterns slower than the metabolic rate of the organism perceiving.
Energy = patterns faster than the metabolic rate of the organism perceiving.
Matter is a term denoting faster patterns, relative to the metabolic rates of the organism, or its brain processes....cellular systolic/diastolic rates.
Matter is not a uniform substance, a magical thing that is all things.
Gold is not silver.
Water is not blood.
Matter is not magic, not a singular thing, substance...it is a word meaning speed of vibration/oscillation, interpreted by mind as rock, metal, tree.
Energy also is a speed of vibration/oscillation....of different kinds - eidos.
The rhythms determines the kind, the speed determines if it will be interpreted as solid or airy or liquid or faster, as energy.Does matter/energy mean life?witchdoctor wrote:I don't think that I do. Are matter-energy magical?
Matter/Energy is not life....as it is not automatically gold or silver.
There is no life energy.
There is life that emanates energy....called aura.
Bio-energy.None of your magic talk, ya here.witchdoctor wrote:Life emanates from matter.
Matter does not emanate goldness, or silver, not bone, nor flesh nor life.
Nice try though.
Matter only means patterns that vibrate/oscillate at a slower rate than energy.
There are intermediate rates, called liquid, gas.
So we have these general groups of speed: matter, liquid, gas, energy...that we can perceive with our senses.
Like the light spectrum goes from Ultra Violet to Infrared and beyond - Electromagnetism.
No life in light.
We also have the sound spectrum.
No life force there either.No switch.witchdoctor wrote:We agree. The only difference apparent to me is that you seem to hold the opinion that life, consciousness, and intelligence are attributes one can either have, or not have, like flipping a switch. One either has life, or does not have life. One either has consciousness, or does not have consciousness. One either has intelligence, or does not have intelligence.
Life is a particular configuration of patterns....patterns that are slow are called matter; patterns that are fast are called energy.
Different configurations are translated as gold, or silver, or water, or stones. These are not alive.
Different configurations of patterns, producing the multiplicity of elements.
Life is such a configuration with specific unique and rare traits = iteration and memory.
Now, how the process of memory storage began will be determined by science.
But it must have to do with fractals...like the Mandelbrot Set....from a simple iterating algorithm ({f{c}(z)=z^{2}+c} )complex repeating shapes emerge.Yes, little sprites hidden in the matter. A universal soul emanating from matter.witchdoctor wrote:I believe that these attributes exist in an infinitely gradual scale, in all shades of grey from near-white to near-black.
There is no life particle, no spirit.
Your occult mind is finally revealed.
No hidden secret in matter. No magical entity.
Spirit means what precedes the birth of an organism.I've learned to read books by looking at their weathered and torn covers.witchdoctor wrote:Who said anything about occult to begin whith?
I deny having knowledge that only a few possess.
The things I say have been written about for millenia. They are available to all.
You cannot claim that you never received a package if you've only glanced at it, and then threw it away.
Again...patterns...you send data despite yourself.Then you believe in ghosts and spirits.witchdoctor wrote:No. Not alive as you seem to conceive of it.
I say that rock has the potential to an ever increasing level of aliveness.
At which state of alivenes it might be, nobody can say. If you are looking for a certainty about how life emerges, you ought to look elsewhere... to paraphrase a friend.
A stones can be explained without evoking will, or judgment, or intent....no telos, no motive.
A stone is not alive, nor can it ever be so.
The elements participating in stones can be part of a configuration that may become alive....The human body is 70% water...water is not alive.
Romantic idealism betrays you.Ha!!witchdoctor wrote:No. Consciousness is an attribute of matter.
So it is like carbon...consciousness is a particle.
Can you show us one.
Declaring it as existing in all things is your belief in Abrahamic God.
Patterns are everywhere...you have a mysterious life force which you simply state as existing.No kidding.witchdoctor wrote:Regardless, what I think does not change the nature of a rock.
You can say magical pixies are part of matter.....so what?
You say nothing about nothing. You imagine shit and you project your internal desires. You expose yourself.
You speak not of world. You speak of your reaction to world.
Your hopes, your desires.
If a someone declares to me, with an air of sophisticated rationalism, that spirits are cause storms, or clouds are monsters, he's doing the exact same thing you are.
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
Join date : 2018-02-13
GoatMan wrote:As you wish.witchdoctor wrote:Edit:
Given that you have not understood a single thing I said, I will give you sufficient time to read again as many times as it takes, and then reply again, with calm and thoughtfulness, to what I wrote alone.
I will be here, and my time is yours once you have demonstrated that it is worth to you at least as much as it is to me.
I will peer into matter and find the life there waiting to emerge.
When all else fails...when emotional appeals, threats fail to have an impact...use ignorance.
'You simply did not understand'.
I, on the other hand, think you did understand me. Because what I say is clear, testable and rational.
But for you, as for many others, it simply is not enough. You want more. Something more inspiring, mystifying, hope-giving....deep and obscure.
Something only a few can truly feel.
The occult has always been misunderstood by the ones that rejected it....like Christians claim that non-believers either hate god, or they do not get it.
It shows in your change in attitude, especially the poetics towards the end.
If you want to believe in life as secretly nestled in matter....don't let me stop you.
You will find an audience...no doubt.
World is full of cowards, idiots and hypocrites.
They've been around forever, always the majority...believing in all sorts of wacky stuff.
Always modern, up-to-date with the latest superposition. Always trendy and enlightened...hippies.
Pass the bong and let's feel the life emanating from matter.
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
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witchdoctor wrote:
I, on the other hand, think you did understand me. Because what I say is clear, testable and rational.
I'm sorry to say this, but I did not understand you. What you say is not clear, nor testable, nor rational.
How is it rational? Either all is nature, or not all is nature. It can't be both.
At the same time that you acknowledge that there is nothing outside of nature, you do not accept life and consciousness as an attribute of matter.
You continue to repeat that life and consciousness are organization and patterns. Of what?
How is any of what you say testable?
But for you, as for many others, it simply is not enough. You want more. Something more inspiring, mystifying, hope-giving....deep and obscure.
Something only a few can truly feel.
It is evident from my reasoning that I am the one who is materialist, not you.
The occult has always been misunderstood by the ones that rejected it....like Christians claim that non-believers either hate god, or they do not get it.
You arrived at this thread, barely skimmed through what I wrote, labeled me occultist, and are talking to people who are not here.
It appears to me that you are the one who is chasing ghosts.
The experience of conversation is happening here and now between you and me, but you are writing to the past and to the future, while wasting the present.
It shows in your change in attitude, especially the poetics towards the end.
I have not changed my attitude for a single moment during this thread, except for this paragraph and the paragraph right above this one, in which I am criticizing your behavior in this thread. I've deleted many of your insults without responding, directed at me and at others who I don't know who they are. I will bring this up to you here once, and then never again.
If you want to believe in life as secretly nestled in matter....don't let me stop you.
Where, then, is life nestled, if not in matter?
You will find an audience...no doubt.
World is full of cowards, idiots and hypocrites.
They've been around forever, always the majority...believing in all sorts of wacky stuff.
Always modern, up-to-date with the latest superposition. Always trendy and enlightened...hippies.
Pass the bong and let's feel the life emanating from matter.
Life emanating from matter, humans descending from monkeys, diseases caused by living things you can't see, all these whacky absurd things that require a person to get rid of his pre-conceptions and prejudices if only for a moment, and approach the subject with interest, good will, and an open mind. Innovation does not proceed from fanatic attachment to dogma. It proceeds from looking at the world with a child's eyes, and imagining what it might be.
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
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GoatMan wrote:Who said anything about life being unnatural?witchdoctor wrote:
I'm sorry to say this, but I did not understand you. What you say is not clear, nor testable, nor rational.
How is it rational? Either all is nature, or not all is nature. It can't be both.
I gave a metaphorical narrative in the other thread to help you.I've defined matter.witchdoctor wrote:At the same time that you acknowledge that there is nothing outside of nature, you do not accept life and consciousness as an attribute of matter.
it's not a magical substance. It does not have life as an attribute.
Matter is not life.
Matter and energy can configure to become life, but it is not automatically life.Bingo!!witchdoctor wrote:You continue to repeat that life and consciousness are organization and patterns. Of what?
Rhythmic oscillation/vibration is a pattern.
What is vibrating?
Space.
What is space?
Possibility.
Matter/Energy can now be defined as probabilities within the field of possibilities.
Mind interprets different patterns as different kinds of matter/energy.Can you not see patterns?witchdoctor wrote:How is any of what you say testable?
If we look into the thickest metal using powerful microscopes, what do we see?
The life element?I never called myself a materialist.witchdoctor wrote:It is evident from my reasoning that I am the one who is materialist, not you.
You are a magic materialist...you see magical essences in matter.No, I responded to everything you wrote.witchdoctor wrote:You arrived at this thread, barely skimmed through what I wrote, labeled me occultist, and are talking to people who are not here.
It appears to me that you are the one who is chasing ghosts.
The experience of conversation is happening here and now between you and me, but you are writing to the past and to the future, while wasting the present.
When you said life emanates from matter...I knew what you are.
A magical aura emanating from all matter....called life. All is alive.I gave you my definition of matter/energy.witchdoctor wrote:Where, then, is life nestled, if not in matter?
Life does not emanate from all matter....it is a particular configuration of matter/energy.
Matter simply means patterns with a particular speeds of oscillation.
Like ultra violet...means light at a particular side of the spectrum with a specific frequency range.
Energy would be the equivalent of the infrared.Life emanating from matter is the same as humans evolved from the same ancestor as other primates?witchdoctor wrote:Life emanating from matter, humans descending from monkeys, diseases caused by living things you can't see, all these whacky absurd things that require a person to get rid of his pre-conceptions and prejudices if only for a moment, and approach the subject with interest, good will, and an open mind. Innovation does not proceed from fanatic attachment to dogma. It proceeds from looking at the world with a child's eyes, and imagining what it might be.
You mix a magical notion with a scientific one hoping to get away with it?
Is a stone alive?
Is life emanating from water?
Don't show me magnetic fields and tell me that is life energy emanating...word-game will not work on me.
Show me the science...since it is equivalent to evolution theory.
Satyr- Posts : 761
Join date : 2018-03-03
Let me use more scientific imagery to help you in your spiritual romanticism and superstitions.
Big Bang creates a field of energy.
Let's call it the fabric of existence.
This is dynamic...at no point is it absolute one or absolute nil.
It is radiating.
This energy interacts in certain ways....life does not emanate from ti like a mystical cloud.
This dynamic energy field is not uniform...it is not one, not complete, not whole.
All we can say about it is that it is dynamic.
Life is not automatic.
In infinite space time in multiple universe, or multiple cycles of the cosmos life does not emerge in all and everywhere.
It would be everywhere if this were so.
We know life is rare, so we know specific circumstances are necessary for it to emerge.
It is not ubiquitous.
We also know it is fragile, it needs specific balances to continue.
It does not magically emanate from all matter.
Matter and energy are necessary, but life is not necessary to matter/energy.
Like gold does not just happen, it does not emanate from matter but is formed under particular circumstances, so too does life emerge from a configuration of matter/energy with specific attributes.
Life is not an attribute of matter like say solidity, or form.
Solidity is the relationship of the conscious organism to a slow pattern....we interpret this slowness as solid. our brain constructs form as an interpretation of a unity's range of effect.
If we look closer the boundary shifts or disappears into a multiplicity of particles....because the mind creates abstractions by freezing patterns into what we call 'things'.
There's no mystical life trait emanating from all matter.
Big Bang creates a field of energy.
Let's call it the fabric of existence.
This is dynamic...at no point is it absolute one or absolute nil.
It is radiating.
This energy interacts in certain ways....life does not emanate from ti like a mystical cloud.
This dynamic energy field is not uniform...it is not one, not complete, not whole.
All we can say about it is that it is dynamic.
Life is not automatic.
In infinite space time in multiple universe, or multiple cycles of the cosmos life does not emerge in all and everywhere.
It would be everywhere if this were so.
We know life is rare, so we know specific circumstances are necessary for it to emerge.
It is not ubiquitous.
We also know it is fragile, it needs specific balances to continue.
It does not magically emanate from all matter.
Matter and energy are necessary, but life is not necessary to matter/energy.
Like gold does not just happen, it does not emanate from matter but is formed under particular circumstances, so too does life emerge from a configuration of matter/energy with specific attributes.
Life is not an attribute of matter like say solidity, or form.
Solidity is the relationship of the conscious organism to a slow pattern....we interpret this slowness as solid. our brain constructs form as an interpretation of a unity's range of effect.
If we look closer the boundary shifts or disappears into a multiplicity of particles....because the mind creates abstractions by freezing patterns into what we call 'things'.
There's no mystical life trait emanating from all matter.
Satyr- Posts : 761
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Monism?
Well, the mind needs complete wholes to process fluid multiplicity.
Binary thinking for simple minds. 1/0
good/bad
All is alive, or all is not alive.
Well, the mind needs complete wholes to process fluid multiplicity.
Binary thinking for simple minds. 1/0
good/bad
All is alive, or all is not alive.
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
Join date : 2018-02-13
GoatMan wrote:"Binary thinking for simple minds. 1/0
Indeed!
witchdoctor wrote:
We agree. The only difference apparent to me is that you seem to hold the opinion that life, consciousness, and intelligence are attributes one can either have, or not have, like flipping a switch. One either has life, or does not have life. One either has consciousness, or does not have consciousness. One either has intelligence, or does not have intelligence.
I believe that these attributes exist in an infinitely gradual scale, in all shades of grey from near-white to near-black.
Satyr- Posts : 761
Join date : 2018-03-03
One more time...using String Theory this time.
A string vibrates...but there is no string. It's a metaphor to aid in conceptualization. There is only vibration.
Easier to equate life as existence, with no beginning and no end.
Then you do not have to explain how it emerges...you can say it exists.
It is an attribute of matter.
Matter is now a tautology with life....words cease to differentiate, now they produce uniformity.
Consciousness is reduced, because to be conscious is to discriminate, to perceive subtle divergence.
Uniformity is a dumbing-down. 'All is God', case closed....no more thinking required.
Tautology: existence is god, god is existence....no more thinking.
All matter lives.
Done, check please.
Nothing new in that religious dogma...secular theism. Deism.
Spinoza. Hebrew psyche.
A string vibrates...but there is no string. It's a metaphor to aid in conceptualization. There is only vibration.
Easier to equate life as existence, with no beginning and no end.
Then you do not have to explain how it emerges...you can say it exists.
It is an attribute of matter.
Matter is now a tautology with life....words cease to differentiate, now they produce uniformity.
Consciousness is reduced, because to be conscious is to discriminate, to perceive subtle divergence.
Uniformity is a dumbing-down. 'All is God', case closed....no more thinking required.
Tautology: existence is god, god is existence....no more thinking.
All matter lives.
Done, check please.
Nothing new in that religious dogma...secular theism. Deism.
Spinoza. Hebrew psyche.
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
Join date : 2018-02-13
GoatMan wrote:One more time...using String Theory this time.
A string vibrates...but there is no string. It's a metaphor to aid in conceptualization. There is only vibration.
Easier to equate life as existence, with no beginning and no end.
Then you do not have to explain how it emerges...you can say it exists.
It is an attribute of matter.
Matter is now a tautology with life....words cease to differentiate, now they produce uniformity.
Consciousness is reduced, because to be conscious is to discriminate, to perceive subtle divergence.
Uniformity is a dumbing-down. 'All is God', case closed....no more thinking required.
Tautology: existence is god, god is existence....no more thinking.
All matter lives.
Done, check please.
Nothing new in that religious dogma...secular theism. Deism.
Spinoza. Hebrew psyche.
I'm sorry, but you have used many words to say nothing at all.
Satyr- Posts : 761
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I'll use less next time, and say even less.
witchdoctor- Posts : 89
Join date : 2018-02-13
GoatMan wrote:Let me use more scientific imagery to help you in your spiritual romanticism and superstitions.
Big Bang creates a field of energy.
Let's call it the fabric of existence.
This is dynamic...at no point is it absolute one or absolute nil.
It is radiating.
This energy interacts in certain ways....life does not emanate from ti like a mystical cloud.
This dynamic energy field is not uniform...it is not one, not complete, not whole.
All we can say about it is that it is dynamic.
What exactly does it add to understanding to create the phrase "fabric of existence" to replace the word matter?
Life is not automatic.
In infinite space time in multiple universe, or multiple cycles of the cosmos life does not emerge in all and everywhere.
It would be everywhere if this were so.
What evidence is there to that?
We know life is rare, so we know specific circumstances are necessary for it to emerge.
It is not ubiquitous.
We also know it is fragile, it needs specific balances to continue.
It does not magically emanate from all matter.
Matter and energy are necessary, but life is not necessary to matter/energy.
Like gold does not just happen, it does not emanate from matter but is formed under particular circumstances, so too does life emerge from a configuration of matter/energy with specific attributes.
Life is not an attribute of matter like say solidity, or form.
Solidity is the relationship of the conscious organism to a slow pattern....we interpret this slowness as solid. our brain constructs form as an interpretation of a unity's range of effect.
If we look closer the boundary shifts or disappears into a multiplicity of particles....because the mind creates abstractions by freezing patterns into what we call 'things'.
There's no mystical life trait emanating from all matter.
We know that of human life, and of what we call the five kingdoms of life.
At the bottom of that structure we have the prokaryotae, which are very unstructured single-cell organisms, which reproduce themselves.
But why stop there?
Much simpler than that, the virus, is not included in the five kingdoms at all. Does not possess the mechanism for reproduction, but does so by kidnapping that of another living organism. It does not respond to stimuli and is not able to produce energy or waste. It has a dormant state in which it more closely resembles a crystal. For these reasons, it is not categorized as being alive. Yet, it grows, multiplies and perpetuates itself.
Much simpler than that, the prion, is not a cell at all. It is a mere chain of proteins. It doesn't possess any of the characteristics of a living organism. Yet, it is able to make copies of itself simply by being in contact with other proteins.
Much simpler than that, chains of aminoacids shorter than a protein are able to form amyloid structureses in the presence of carbonyl sulphide. Given a favorable environment, even substances we consider inanimate are able to grow and become more complex.
By means of the attributes of its own molecular composition, matter arranges itself in increasing levels of complexity.
By means of the attributes of its own atomic composition.
By means of its specific energetic composition.
What you call life is a reflection of you. You infer that those entities which possess similar characteristics as you must be like you, thus because you are alive, what is like you is alive.
To allow human composition to dictate the standard for all nature is narrow-minded at best.
Satyr- Posts : 761
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Whatever you say.
Satyr- Posts : 761
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You are a fascinating mind, destined for great things. Your grasp of my Love Ontology needs some honing but you have the raw materials to become one of my greatest pupils.
A question:
Does matter emanate silver, gold, does it emanate water, or is life force the only thing it emanates?
Is matter a sort of material grounding for the spiritual world to emanate?
A question:
Does matter emanate silver, gold, does it emanate water, or is life force the only thing it emanates?
Is matter a sort of material grounding for the spiritual world to emanate?
Satyr- Posts : 761
Join date : 2018-03-03
Compassion demands a sacrifice.witchdoctor wrote:I'll give him my time as I would to any of my friends here, even you.
I am your friend?
I know...witchdoctor wrote:Not indiscriminately. I have already made that clear.
I am doing as I say right now.
I think I was clear on the matter.witchdoctor wrote:So you agree with me that there are things which are not considered alive by a scientific definition, but which present such characteristics as to seem like they are on a path toward higher organization. Not devoid of life, but alive on a much more rudimentary level of the scale.
This is why I disagreed with your declarative statement that matter is life.
Like saying 'liquid is blood' or 'gas is oxygen'.
Matter is not life. It can be arranged to become alive.
So that you are aware of what you are agreeing with.witchdoctor wrote:If you don't want to repeat yourself, why do you repeat yourself after I've said that is OK with me?
Why do you assume that you attack only what is harming you?witchdoctor wrote:When you can't reason with whatever is harming you, just protect yourself, and let them carry on, in their own way. They will learn one way or another. There is time.
Do you bathe only when you get ill?
Therein lies the paradox....no suffering leads to atrophying and death....too much leads to fragmentation and death.witchdoctor wrote:Not at all. You can not infer that from anything I said. I've called suffering a great teacher.
Suffering is not bad. Suffering is not a thinking entity which is capable of choice. It can't be good or bad.
Those who disseminate, perpetuate, and grow suffering act badly, but they are also not bad, themselves. They are simply adrift. Like you.
Hellenic asceticism: balance - ΠΑΝ ΜΕΤΡΟΝ ΑΡΙΣΤΟΝ
Would an athlete not be proud of the time and effort he's sacrificed?witchdoctor wrote:You are attached to you suffering as a means of valuing yourself. You say I suffered, I overcame through my grit, but your pride and your pain both are passing things. They are an illusion. The only thing that remains is what you cause.
Not of exactly the same 'thing'.witchdoctor wrote:There is both. There is an infinite variety of instances of the same thing.
Every complex unity, made of many patterns, is never exactly the same with another. You are never the same as yourself a second ago.
Fluidity.
Like I said...it's an evolved survival behaviour to facilitate cooperative strategies.witchdoctor wrote:Mockery dully noted
You remind me of a kid who comes to introduce me to some cool new music, and I have to tell him that that's a shitty cover from an awesome song from the 70s
Compassion, and the path, are much much older than christianism. There is a greater time distance between the onset of these ideas and christianism, than there is between the onset of christianism and today.
Christianity, like all things Abrahamic, warped it and made it into an illness.
Excellent question.witchdoctor wrote:If I may as, what does "emanating excess attraction" mean?
What is "due to a surplus". Surplus of what, "excess attraction"? How does matter acquire a surplus of excess attraction? Attraction of what?
What does it mean to say that an organism emanates a field of attraction/repulsion?
Harmony is attraction....disharmony is repulsion.
Both are part of every interaction. The more in harmony two patterns are, the less repulsion, friction, the more the path towards one another is of least resistance, in comparison to all other paths.
Now, imagine that there is no void...all that exists is dynamic.
Space, perceived as cold, void, is really dynamic. There is no absolute zero degrees...except in theory.
All has a temperature. This means all has energy, is energy....though you cannot see it...so your mind interprets this as darkness.
So, all is interacting continuously to a degree. Now some of this void space is imperceptible because the energy is random - chaotic. This is why particles can emerge seemingly out of nowhere and then disappear into nowhere.
Randomness, by definition, can become pattern, and then lose its pattern...as it is random.
Perhaps this is black matter....but whatever.
So, a unity's field of effect, is what is left-over from the unity's internal aggregate attraction/repulsion. Since we call ti unity, and we use unity to refer to two or more patterns in balance, then we imply by 'unity' that the patterns are in balance...that is their aggregate attraction exceeds their aggregate repulsion. This is its field of effect, that radiates by interacting with other patterned (ordered) and non-patterned (chaotic - random) energies.
Like smell emanates from a corpse as particles of its decay...so does the unity affect its peripheral patterned and non-patterned energies.
Follow so far?
Okay so this in our example is excess attraction, so the energies move towards the unity....we call this space warped by mass....gravity is explained using this image.
This means that energies that are less powerful than the aggregate of the patterns participating in the unity will fall towards the unity.
These are metaphors to clarify what cannot be perceived, but only inferred from the observable.witchdoctor wrote:Were these words put together to explain, or to obscure?
This is why I say metaphysics is the foundations of a structure that must be in the physical, in the empirical world.
The two must be aligned, or support each other, not contradict one another. The physical informs or points to the metaphysical...as it also points to the idealistic.
Now, I must admit that I do not much respect metaphysics....particularly when it is supernatural and extraordinary, contradicted by the perceived, the empirical....I think it is a waste of time.
It is best to construct one to solidify your theories of the physical, but it is a secondary matter...not as many obsess over it as if it were profound and primary.
My primary interest is of the physical, focused around life and the human condition....That's why my positions gravitate around socioeconomic, and psychology....like Feminization of Mankind, and Nihilism.
I was forced to explore the metaphysics early after my Feminization of Mankind when i was bombarded with absurdities. They are not unique....but the way I explain them is. Process Ontology is one book I read much later that is along the same lines.
They go back to pre-Socratics....I've added my own contributions.
What i offer as original and my own is my insight into Nihilism and how it emerges, what it is, how it spreads. Feminization was but the tip of an iceberg.
I'm a diagnostician....you can say.
Ha...I do not like using words like emanate...too vague and they imply mystical concepts.witchdoctor wrote:You just said that matter can be organized to emanate life.
Once matter is organized, and then it is emanating life, does it become magical to you then?
Or is it all the same matter?
But after further consideration I think it is a good metaphor.
Radiates...is better.
But matter does not automatically emanate life, as if life and matter were tautologies or part of some union. An arrangement of matter and energy, can or might.
Matter does not emanate goldness,,,,,gold can be formed by matter under particular circumstances. like the kinds of pressures found within stars. It is rare.